177- How to Test and Treat Your Home for Mold with Jason Earle

[00:00:15] Bryan Carroll: Now the spring time has finally arrived the moisture content and the humidity and the areas that we. Penn to start to increase this time of year, which can lead to a lot of different issues inside of your home, including mold growth, which is what we're going to be talking about.

[00:00:33] In this episode today, what's up everyone. I'm Bryan Carroll and I'm here to help people move more, eat well and be adventurous. And today I have Jason Earle on the show to teach us all about how to test your home for. And see if mold is having an impact on your health. If you know my story, then you know that I was exposed to mold and it laid me up for months and months, and I really couldn't do anything.

[00:00:56] I literally felt like I was dying. So mold is definitely a toxic environmental exposure that we want to avoid. And with all this humidity and moisture in the air, there are ways that we can help to reduce that moisture content and also test our different rooms in our home. To see if there is any mold spores or anything along those lines.

[00:01:18] Now when I had my mold exposure, I wish that there was products available on the market. Like there are now that make it a lot easier to test your living environment for mold. Back then, people really weren't talking that much about mold and its impacts on people's health. And now that larger companies, larger buildings are getting impacted by mold and we're seeing the impact of that.

[00:01:42] For instance here in Seattle we had the children's hospital actually have deaths among some of the patients because of mold. We are now seeing in real time what this stuff can do to us. And it's not good. So we want to avoid it as much as. So Jason Earle is a man on a mission. He realized that his moldy childhood home was an underlying cause of his extreme allergies and asthma.

[00:02:06] And that, that led him into the healthy home business in 2002. And since then, for the last couple of decades, he's been working on trying to figure out how to test more efficiently your homes and living spaces for mold so that you can get ahead of it before the mold really takes over. The remediation process tends to cost way more if the mold gets out of hand.

[00:02:29] But before we dive into this conversation with Jason, I have been using an electrolyte called element L M N T for, I dunno, a year now at this point. And I have it every single morning. First thing when I wake up and not only does it taste good, but it makes it feel like I'm hydrating much faster. I'm able to have more energy when I wake up and I feel refreshed.

[00:02:52] And ready to go for the day. Typically I don't like to put stuff in my drinks. Usually I'm just a plain old water type of person, but element actually tastes really good and it's been very effective. So if you want to learn more about it, then head on over to summit for wellness.com/l M N T, and take a look at the different flavors they have.

[00:03:14] Usually I use raspberry, but I think they have great fruit coming out, which last year we really liked. And that one usually only comes in a smaller supplies, so it's like a seasonal type of flavor. So again, go on over to summit for wellness.com/l M N T to learn more about element. All right. Let's dive into my conversation with Jason.

[00:03:38] Thank you, Jason, for coming onto the show. Good 

[00:03:41] Jason Earle: to be here. Thanks. Of 

[00:03:43] Bryan Carroll: course, and I'm excited to chat with you because we both have our own stories with mold. But I want to hear a little bit more about your story with mold. So can you give us a little background on how mold has impacted your life and how that changed the direction that you are now going with your life?

[00:03:59] Jason Earle: Sure. Best place to start it's in the beginning. If rewind all the way back. I grew up on a small non-working farm outside of Princeton, New Jersey. And it was a it was sort of a ramshackle house. I'd say there's there's, there was, there was a lot of sort of unfinished repairs and things like that.

[00:04:19] And We were you know, that the, the family dynamics were typical sort of the seventies and eighties, there was a low level of awareness around health and indoor air quality and things like that. But I, I suddenly got sick at the age of 40. Where I lost a ton of weight. And I I was having difficulty breathing.

[00:04:37] So my parents brought me to the pediatrician who said, you should actually take him to the hospital. And so they brought me to children's hospital, which is renowned for respiratory illness. And their initial diagnosis was was shocking to my parents. Devastating actually, initially based on my symptoms and family history, they thought I had cystic fibrosis which was a death sentence back.

[00:04:59] And it was particularly dismaying to my father who had lost four of his cousins before the age of 14 to CF. So they spent the next six weeks basically crying while they waited for the second opinion, which fortunately confirmed, they didn't have cystic fibrosis evidenced by the fact that I stand here talking to you at 45 years old.

[00:05:19] And actually what I had was asthma compounded by the. Which was my first big dose of antibiotics, which is another tangent. But we could, we could pursue a whole nother podcast actually. And they tested me for allergies and back then they did it. I'm not sure how they do it now, but I, they put me in basically have papoose or like a straight jacket for toddlers.

[00:05:39] My back was exposed and they had a grid drawn and they tested me for all of the, the allergens and I tested positive for every single thing that. Every single thing my dad said, I looked at the lady bug, a big red swollen back with dots all over it. And and so it was, you know, I was, again, growing up on a small non-working farm, but surrounded by, you know, all of these different you know, common allergies.

[00:06:04] I was allergic to every single thing that I was around, grass, wheat, corn, eggs, dogs, cats, even cotton. So my clothing sheets were problematic for me. And so I lived like that basically on inhalers. And actually interestingly spending a lot of time outside for some reason, my intuitively I guess my body knew that there was something indoors was, was undesirable there.

[00:06:26] And when I was about 12 years old, my parents, my parents split up and moved. I moved out of the house and all my symptoms suddenly went away. It wasn't instant, but it was, it was, it was fast enough that we just chalked it up to me growing out of my asthma, the way my grandmother. And I didn't think about it again until fast forward.

[00:06:43] And I had, I, I had a series of my mom died suddenly and, and I, and I, and I got Lyme disease within about a year. And I missed a lot of school dropped out of high school and ended up getting rescued out of the gas station to go work on wall street, which is again, another story for maybe another podcast.

[00:06:58] But after nine years of that, I decided to go on walk about after the.com bubble burst. I decided that I, I want to do something meaningful about. And while I was away, I read about a guy who'd gotten sick. I was actually in Hawaii reading about a guy who was in Hawaii, who had gotten sick from the hotel where he was an employee.

[00:07:15] And and he had at 40 years old had developed something called adult onset, asthma, something I'd never heard of as well as all these allergies to foods and, and other other things that he'd never had a problem with before. And it was like a deja VU moment for me. And I immediately thought, okay, And he blamed the mold in the hotel where he was working which turned out to be the biggest mold problem in modern history.

[00:07:38] It was a $55 million mold remediation project, the Hilton CLIA tower, and in Oahu that's an interesting thing to Google, but any case the bottom line is that when I saw that and I read that, I thought, Hmm, I wonder if we had a mold problem, that'll try and road. I wonder if that was the issue.

[00:07:55] So I called my dad from a. But it probably isn't there anymore and said, I said, Hey man, do you think we had a mold problem? It'll try and rough. And he just laughed at me. He said, of course we had mold. We had mushrooms in the basement. Why do you ask? And it was just that sort of like that flippant, he just, he, he, he was like, of course.

[00:08:11] Yeah, of course. You know, of course we had mold. I said, do you think it contributed to, to, to my to my respiratory illness? And he said, well, certainly didn't help. And, but that, but that just goes back to like the seventies and eighties where, you know, my parents both smoked two indoors and in the car with the windows closed you know, and it wasn't for lack of love, it was lack of awareness.

[00:08:31] And it was, you know, it was that there was a law that was a widespread lack of awareness back then. But I immediately became fascinated with not just mold, but actually have buildings impact. And we spend 90% of our time indoors. And and everyone's worried about the outdoor environment and focus.

[00:08:48] We focus very little on the indoor environment where we actually have real control, but in essence, really what mold did for me was. It it, first of all, it was an, a major impediment to my quality of life as a, as a kid. But it was such a mysterious thing that nobody really could pin the tail on the donkey.

[00:09:02] But as an when I, when I discovered this, what I, what I recognized at least shortly after I started doing the work, cause I came back to New Jersey after, after my stint in Hawaii. And again, got into the industry to actually took a job, working for a company that was doing remediation to learn the ropes before.

[00:09:19] Our our, our companies. But what, what it did was it, it, it gave, it connected me with a sense of purpose that I had been missing in wall street. And it gave me the opportunity to sort of, you know, find a way to, to, to to, to truly be useful in a way that wasn't contrived in any way, you know, when you overcome something it gives you the ability to authentically source something that you could never other, any other.

[00:09:45] And so in many ways, mold gave me the tools to, to make me a truly useful person. 

[00:09:52] Bryan Carroll: Are you, you mentioned going to the children's hospital, are you familiar with the children's hospital issue that Seattle had a couple of years ago? 

[00:10:00] Jason Earle: Yes. The irony, right. 

[00:10:02] Bryan Carroll: Yeah. Yeah. It's super interesting. For people that don't know, essentially you would think a hospital is a hyper sterilized place, but they had a mold issue in one of the wards in the children's hospital and some children actually died from it.

[00:10:15] And that's when they were realized that they had a big issue. But how many, a hospital places do you think have. Mold issues without even knowing 

[00:10:25] Jason Earle: well, so hospitals in general have a combination of problems. First of all, they over sanitize everything. So they, they, they use wide spectrum antimicrobials at the virals.

[00:10:37] And so as a result, all the only thing is that live in hospitals are things that are on the way that are in the process of dying or the strong. Possible pathogenic, microbes. That's all that survives. And so hospitals are notorious for being a place to go. If you're not to go, if you're very sick because in fact, if you're susceptible that's where your.

[00:11:02] The resistant strains mold is not it doesn't fall into that same category in terms of, you know, the bacteria. There are obviously resistant fungi, and those are nasty and those are, those are serious problem, but just garden variety mold is serious enough for someone who's experiencing any sort of health issues.

[00:11:21] I would say that the vast majority of of hospitals. Commercial buildings that are under any sort of budget constraint schools in particular universities anywhere where budgets are, are constrained and there's any form of deferred maintenance. The first thing that's going to happen is moisture problems.

[00:11:42] And the first thing happens with the moisture problems, mold mold, all that happens very quickly. If you have a moisture problem, it only takes 24 to 48 hours for it to start. And so, so people tend to think about mold as something that kind of happens like a lightning strike or an earthquake. Like it's something that happens to them.

[00:11:57] But it's actually a very, very predictable biological reality and it gets wet and stays where it gets moldy. And so a little deferred maintenance can become a very big mold problem. And so to answer your question, I think a lot of hospitals 

[00:12:08] Bryan Carroll: now how much moisture does it take for mold to start growing?

[00:12:12] Like does a little bit, cause that like a big mold issue or does it take quite a bit of a while? 

[00:12:19] Jason Earle: Well, so mold likes dampness. And so rather than like liquid water. So in other words, when something gets wet mold tends to like it when it's either just getting wet or just getting dry. Actual liquid water is not friendly for mold GRA whether or not you'll see more in, in the in bacterium and other microbes like that, but like water but mold likes to grow right at the edge of wet and dry.

[00:12:51] So so in fact Daphnis is really the main. Thing to be aware of when it comes to mold, because mold is really not the problem. Believe it or not a mold has got the mold is a four-letter word and there's plenty of reasons to be concerned about mold. But the real problem with mold is the moisture. And it takes very little moisture.

[00:13:12] In fact, it can be so subtle that you won't even notice that moisture is, is happening. So there's a technical term. It's called water. Some people call that condensation but basically where you've got humidity in the air that develops as little tiny droplets on a surface. And we've all seen that happen on windows, you know, on the, in the glass and your shower.

[00:13:33] That also happens on sheet rock around your windows, or even on poorly insulated wall. Or even just where you've got high humidity can happen on everything. And so when, when things just get that little bit of dampness, that is the sweet spot. So, so make no mistake. If you see liquid water, you have a problem, but you can have enough dampness that you can't see.

[00:13:52] And that's why it's very important to monitor. With gauges because we're not very good humidity, gauges, humans, we do an accurate, we're actually not built for that. Our sense are, are our senses are good for hot and cold. We don't do wet very well, believe it or not. And so, so the bottom line is it does not take much water and it doesn't take very long.

[00:14:12] And so it's extremely important that you're vigilant and raise your awareness around. 

[00:14:17] Bryan Carroll: Hm. Now you had mentioned to me that you live in a place that gets some big temperature swings, which when you have those big temperature swings, does that create more condensation? 

[00:14:28] Jason Earle: Yes, that's a great question. So the main thing that forms condensation is actually temperature difference.

[00:14:34] So I live in Minnesota now. And so of course it's cold, very cold here for about six months out of the year. And so what that will do is just like a glass of, of a glass of ice water. We'll have water beat up on the outside when the, when it's cold outside you know, you'll see obviously what our activity or connotation on windows and things like that, that where there's no insulation where there's, there's no resistance to that.

[00:15:01] The temperature transfer. But that also happens inside of walls. And it also happens on the surfaces, especially down low around baseboard trim. That's why when you'll see in a basement or typically the mold will manifest very low on the wall, not from a leak per se, but from. Moist air. And of course down low is cooler.

[00:15:19] So cold air will hold less water. It will actually be, will squeeze the water out and you'll actually get condensation down lower on the walls rather than have higher on those were warm areas. So you always want to look down and towards outside of walls, if there's concerns about humidity that might be forming condensation and leading to mocha.

[00:15:38] Bryan Carroll: Interesting. So in places with those temperature changes, how do you. Minimize it mold new growth in between the walls when you are getting those swings. 

[00:15:47] Jason Earle: Most important thing you can do is first of all, well-insulated building, won't have that dynamic. So if you've got issues with, you know, some standard installation, that would be something you'd run towards.

[00:15:56] If you live in a very extreme. The other thing, and the most important thing is you want to really manage your humidity. It's really the name of the game. So the ASHRAE, which is the American society of refrigeration and heating and air conditioning engineers. It has a guidance on this and they suggest that you keep your heat indoors relative humidity between 40 and 60%.

[00:16:20] And with a target of 45% all year. Now I will tell you that it's impossible to stay at 45%, basically in the winter time, it's going to get really low in most cases. And then in the summertime, it'll get really high in Mo in most climates and, you know and so most of the time you're just going to kind of pass by 45 to say hello when you pass it.

[00:16:40] And then you're going to pass it again when the seasons change. But if you, if you, if you do a good job of, of monitoring that, so dehumidifying when necessary and then humidifying when necessary. I always say you shouldn't modify. But you don't quantify. And so when it comes to moisture in the air because again, we, our hands and our, our bodies are not good sensors for humidity.

[00:17:01] You want to get gauges, you want to get those digital humidity sensors, set them up on your phone with. And you want to make sure that when it goes below 40%, you're humidifying. And then when it goes above 60% of your dehumidify, that's the best thing you can do to control condensation, because you're not going to be able to control the outside temperature.

[00:17:19] You're probably not going to control very well. The materials that your building is made out of immediately, but the one thing you can't control is how much moisture you're allowing to accumulate in your building, which of course means that you may have to change things like that. Then only ventilating bathrooms and kitchens and things like that.

[00:17:35] Anytime you see liquid water clean that up immediately, because again, you got 24 to 48 hours. But humans produce moisture. We exhale, we plant, what are our plants? We cook, we clean, we're producing my shit all the time. And so it's very important that you monitor and then, and then mitigate as this.

[00:17:52] Bryan Carroll: It's actually pretty interesting how much moisture we put out. Sometimes when we go backpacking, we might leave late at night to get to the Trailhead and then we'll sleep in the car and then get started then the next morning. But even that just a little bit of sleeping in the car, we can wake up and all the insides are frozen.

[00:18:10] There's just tons of moisture everywhere. And it's just from two people breathing for a couple of hours within the. 

[00:18:16] Jason Earle: Absolutely. Yeah. I've noticed that if you go, if you switch your, your your circulation setting on your car so that you're allowing air in versus not allowing air in you'll quickly see that in the winter time, your car will fog up and you won't be able to see it.

[00:18:32] You'll you'll, you'll, you'll create what our activity you'll create a humidity cloud in the car with just one person. And just a matter of minutes we are, we are. The respiration through transport through our, through our skin, it's coming out. I mean, we are producing and, and, and. And distributing moisture also again, you know, just the little things, I mean, not having a properly vented bathroom exhaust fan can, can lead to serious problems not having your kitchen exhaust.

[00:18:59] It's incredible how much moisture we produce dry and close inside. It's a common mistake. We see, we even see people that will run their dryer vent into their, into their house instead of to the outside, to, to, to keep to for heat and, and also for humidity. And of course, you know, you're also introducing all sorts of lint.

[00:19:14] Even if you're filtering, it's just. This is something that, that people are just starting to wake up to, even though we've been living with mold since before the day, the Dawn of humanity. We're just now sort of waking up to it now as, as a modern society. 

[00:19:31] Bryan Carroll: Yeah. Very interesting. And going along with the, we've been living with mold for a long time why is indoor mold so much more potent than.

[00:19:42] You know, being outside, walking through the forest with mold on all the trees and algae and fungi and all that type of stuff. What's the difference? That's 

[00:19:51] Jason Earle: a good question. So first of all, fun fact the kingdom fungi produces 50 mega tons which is the equivalent of 500,000 blue whales. Worth of spores every year, every year.

[00:20:07] Okay. So Mo spores are the king kingdom. Fungi is the largest producer of biological parts. In the world. And so we are awash in these things. I mean, there's no avoiding it. And that's good because without the kingdom fungi, every time a tree dies, it would just stay there. And it wouldn't run.

[00:20:27] That's why we have coal by the way. And oil is all the, there was a time in our, in our world where we didn't have fungi. The, that those elements actually went down deep and, and they became our carbon resources. But the bottom line is in, in when it comes to why indoor mold is more potent or more of a health concern than outdoor mold.

[00:20:47] It really comes down to concentration. So outside air is, is, is, is constantly changing. Even when you're at the gas station, I bet a good analogy, right? That if you go to the gas station, you smell the gasoline you fill up your gas tank and you may get a face full of it here and there. But as soon as you leave, it's it's done.

[00:21:07] But if you take that gas can and bring it and put it in your living. Yeah. Someone's going to get sick eventually. Right. And so the same thing happens with mold mold outside when it's doing its thing, you know, digesting and breaking down organic matter things that were at one time, living like sticks and leaves.

[00:21:24] It's doing its job when it's doing that to your sheet rock or the, or the, your belongings. That's not so, so good. But also while mold is growing, it's producing a number of different things. Just like we produce gases. Digest things. Mold produces gases, which is that musty smell, which has very serious health effects, especially to sensitive individuals, but even people who aren't sensitive, complain of things like headaches, nausea, dizziness, fatigue, difficulty concentrating, things like that.

[00:21:53] A lot of cognitive issues. People that are sensitive, may it may trigger asthma attacks and sinus issues. So the smell that must, that must be smell accumulates in doors. And, and whereas it doesn't, you would not be exposed to any significant amount of it outdoors because it's, these, these chemicals are made in literally parts per billion tiny little minute amounts.

[00:22:12] But if you can tell if you may have a factory of these things in your head, It gets dense and concentrated. Also the spores, the spores, which mold produces when it's actively growing, it's producing the seeds to go forth and multiply. Again, outside, you might be exposed to enough to trigger a minor reaction if you're sensitive but indoors, the high concentration can overwhelm people that, that that are susceptible to to exposure to those allergens.

[00:22:38] And then the, the, the, the thing that the media loves to talk about is mycotoxins which is. The the chemical weaponry that fungi use to kill each other. And we just get caught in the crosshairs fungi that make toxins, use them to for competitive reasons. It's really chemical warfare on a microscopic level.

[00:23:00] And so the black mold that the, they talk about toxic mold that they talked about, which is kind of a misnomer because their molds that produce toxins that aren't black and the black mold is. Not all black molds are toxic and, and even the black toxic molds don't produce it all the time, even so, but th those, those, when they are producing and they are in production and they are actually doing their thing.

[00:23:19] And by the way, those molds are this by-product of chronic dampness. You don't see those when you just get something gets wet and stays wet for a couple of days. That's a long sign of a longterm problem. Those toxins can, can accumulate and, and become hazardous to all health human and. And the likes.

[00:23:38] So indoor mold in essence is problematic because it's a factory while it's digesting, it's producing all these things and they get trapped and we get concentrated. And again, we spend 90% of our time indoors. And so we're re breathing these things constantly. So not only is it concentrated, even a small chemical exposure, indoors is a repeated exposure.

[00:24:00] You breathe ready for this 13, 14 times a minute. If you do the math. 20,000 times a day. So if you're exposed to something in your home, it's not like being exposed at the gas station. You're being exposed to that gas can 20,000 times a day. That's why, 

[00:24:19] Bryan Carroll: yeah. What's a really interesting as some of the most dangerous biological weapons that.

[00:24:26] Are currently known, have been made from mold and mold spores. So that's just how dangerous mold is. You mentioned walking into a place and smelling that musty smell. Once you smell the must. Is it too late? Does that mean there's already a big mold problem? 

[00:24:42] Jason Earle: Well, bigger, not a, if you smell it, you got it.

[00:24:45] You know, the question is w what's the source. Of the moisture. And then what's the extent of the mold growth and that's where you get into testing and inspections and, and those kinds of things. That's where an experience I, and, you know, good old fashioned laboratory science can, can really help you.

[00:25:03] But yeah, the musty smell, I always say, if you see it, smell it or feel it, you have it. And so, or at least if you see it, smell it. If you see something, smell something, or it feels, I mean, do something take action. But the musty odor is a dead giveaway. In fact, the musty odor is there's all sorts of research emerging on this.

[00:25:19] It's the second leading indicator of childhood asthma behind maternal smoking. It also increases asthma risk and children, if they're just exposed to it as a, as a, as a baby by 250. And there's a whole bunch of other interesting studies about the connection between mold and dampness and depression.

[00:25:36] And some of the research that's gone into that has actually shown that a fruit flies exposed to the musty smell, stopped producing dopamine. They stop reproducing, they develop the Parkinsonian like symptoms, and essentially, essentially they get depressed. And so the musty smell is not just an indicator of growth.

[00:25:51] It's also. 

[00:25:53] Bryan Carroll: Fascinating fascinating. What are some good ways that people can test their living spaces? Is there like at home tests that you can do or do you have to bring someone into start testing everything in the house? 

[00:26:06] Jason Earle: So we so I, I I have a mold inspection company called 1-800-GOT-MOLD. And, and all we do is mold inspections and remediation to.

[00:26:14] And we do that because there are a lot of companies out there that do remediation and inspections. And so they're buttering their bread on both sides. That's illegal in many states, but there are many states where it's not illegal. And so, you know, getting involved with a professional takes a specific, you know, you have to really know what you're looking for.

[00:26:32] Oftentimes you can do take the first steps. Yourself. And I encourage people to try to do that whenever possible. But th the spectrum for testing is if you want to have your assets are promoted, you can either sort of go to home Depot or Lowe's and buy one of these $10 Petri dishes at the checkout.

[00:26:49] Those are called settling plates. They don't work. So I would record. Using this they're scientifically invalid. They always grow mold. And by the way, if you're concerned about mold in your house, the first thing you want to do is probably not grow more of it. And that's what they suggest you do.

[00:27:01] All the way on the other side of the spectrum is companies like mine. 1-800-GOT-MOLD, this mold inspection company, where all we do is mold assessments and remediation consulting. And, and, and our inspections are. Not the most expensive, but also not the cheapest. And they average around $1,500 or so for a single family home.

[00:27:17] So it's out of reach for a lot of people as the first step in the middle, there's a lot of junk science. There's do it yourself. Test kit down. That are that look like they might be good science. There's a product called IRMI which is very commonly promoted. A lot of well-intended, but misinformed doctors recommend it.

[00:27:38] And that's a dust sample. That's run through a DNA sequencing. I highly recommend people not use that. And as a result, actually of looking at all of this junk science that's out there we decided a few years ago to create a, do it yourself, test kit that would actually provide scientifically valid results.

[00:27:53] Without breaking the bank. And so we looked at what the professional PR professionals use and figured out what the obstacles were to to the consumer. And basically what we did was we took the same devices that we use, which are called spore traps. Little, especially engineered cassettes that capture airborne particulate matter.

[00:28:09] And and we created an air sampling pump that duplicates professional air sampling pumps that you can actually test the air with the same devices that professionals use, but without the cost or hassle associated. Trying to find it higher one. And we just launched that. That's actually, we just brought that out a few months ago, so we're just coming out of beta testing for that.

[00:28:26] But really in terms of what the consumer has to choose from, it's not easy. It's mostly junk science. It's very noisy. And also there's a lot of people offering things like free inspections. Be careful if that guy's gotta get paid somehow. Right. There's, there's, it's really, I would say for the consumer it's, it's a.

[00:28:46] Caveat emptor quite frankly. But if anybody wants to check out, you know, go to dot com, you'll see. Well, we think it's the best of breed in this space in terms of do it yourself, test kits as a cost effective first step, not as a replacement for a professional inspection. Of course. I must say that.

[00:28:59] Because any event that you have a result from a do it yourself testing, you still need to know how that. And what to do. And, and unless you've got a very small mold problem under 10 square feet, according to the EPA, which is only three foot by three foot. And even that could be a little too much.

[00:29:16] You should, you should defer to a professional for actual action on remediation. 

[00:29:22] Bryan Carroll: Now, if you walk in and you smell mold or smell the Montessori to see mold would you still recommend doing the at-home test or at that point, do you call someone in to start doing remediate? 

[00:29:33] Jason Earle: Well, so I look at the, I use a building as a body metaphor, so and so I look at an inspection kind of like a physical you know, and I look at remediation like surgery.

[00:29:47] And so I always ask people if they, when they've got a problem, if they just scheduled. Where did they go to the doctor and get a proper assessment on getting evaluation done. People love to skip over and inspection. They love to cause it's an extra expense, but the inspection tells you the inspection should be done by a qualified, independent.

[00:30:09] Professional that has no financial ties to the remediation contractor. So they can come in and, and, and give you unbiased advice. That's free of ulterior motives and so a proper inspection. That's one of the reasons why we created the test case, because there are so few in. Testing companies. And there are so many conflicted companies that are doing inspections and testing their own work.

[00:30:33] That all say they would never abuse their privilege by, by, you know, using that data. But they're all, you know, they're entitled to their, to their high horse. The reality is I see what happens and, and, and in the real world and these, these rooms where there's room for abuse, you'll, you'll find abuse.

[00:30:52] So. So what we, what we recommend is that people get a a qualified independent inspector who will come in and perform a physical inspection collect whatever samples are necessary to identify the location and extent of the problem. Develop a remediation plan, which is a step-by-step. Sort of the sheet of music, contractor stance too.

[00:31:13] And then the contractor will come in and use that document to, to bid on the project. That's the way it should be done. But people love the idea of using a test kit and immediately go into remediation. That will be a lot. Using a pregnancy test kit. And then when it says positive buying baby furniture and scheduling scheduling your, your you know, scheduling the due date.

[00:31:34] Yeah. There's, there's a whole bunch missing in the middle there. And so just a, a serious consideration for anybody. That's got a mold problem. Don't just go right from, do it yourself, or just write to a mediator because that will inevitably increase the size and the scope of the project. Right.

[00:31:50] Remediators get paid by the size and the scope. And, and also you don't have the checks and balances that you get from having an independent third party that's there to, to, to, to protect your interests. This also going to do the testing at the end to make sure that you've gotten what you paid for before you release the final funds to the contractor.

[00:32:07] A good incentive. We'll actually be your advocate will be the buffer that you need. We'll protect you. That's why we created one. I entered them all really. It was to protect people from, from the contractors. And so we've been doing that for 20 years. The problem is there aren't that many out there nationwide to, to offer that service.

[00:32:23] And, you know, again, that's why we've created the. 

[00:32:26] Bryan Carroll: Yep. And anyone listening to this episode, you can get 10% off at dot com slash summit for wellness using the code summit 10, which is very generous of you to offer. Now, Jason, what is your vision of what healthy looks like and what steps do you take every single day to reach that vision?

[00:32:46] Jason Earle: Health is it is it's one of those it's like, what do you, how do you define success? How do you define health? These are, these are these are words that we use so loosely, but if, you know, w when you sit and think about it, they tend to be defined by their opposites. Like health can be often defined as the absence of illness.

[00:33:08] And. I think that that leaves a big gap for me health health, or being healthy looks like resilience. So you bounce back quickly from whatever it is emotional, physical you know, and spiritual even resilience I think is a hallmark of, of health vitality as well. And I mean, vitality, I mean, Abundant energy you know, the ability to, to, to take in energy and to be a source of it as well.

[00:33:40] I think that that's, you know another sort of key hallmark for me Groundedness also kind of comes to mind to the idea that, you know, you know, humans, the word human comes from humus or, or soil. And I think that being grounded is also a sign of health. You know, there's, there's a bunch of different humility is actually also comes from the same, same.

[00:34:01] So I, I think that grandness, but I think, I think overall and sort of where it meets the work that we do, I think positive. Relationship with your your, your environment and with the relationships in your life is also health. You know, longevity is closely tied to the quality of your relationships.

[00:34:22] And I would argue that the house, the buildings that you live and work in are actually an extension of your immune system. Exoscan and exoskeleton, and your relationship with the building not only has an impact on the longevity of the building but because. Shelter is one of the base. One of the four basic human needs.

[00:34:40] Our relationship is a mutual relationship with the building. We need it, and it needs us a house that's left. Unoccupied will actually collapse on itself in that. So, so I think a beneficial relationship, positive relationship with your environment which means a higher level of awareness and recognition of your responsibility in, in that relationship is also sort of a foundational aspect of.

[00:35:03] Bryan Carroll: I love it. Are there any final things you want to make sure we touch on when it comes to mold and testing your home and making sure your environment is mold-free 

[00:35:13] Jason Earle: I'm just going to remind everybody that mold is a moisture problem. Okay. So the mold is not actually doing anything to you. Mold is not the bad guy at the end of the day, mold is actually when it produces.

[00:35:26] The musty odor and the chemicals, and even the spores, I would argue that mold is actually sending you a message. If you smell that smell, it's letting you know that there's a problem in your building. And I would look at that as a benevolent action on the part of mold, letting you know that there's a problem.

[00:35:40] So mold is a moisture problem and act quickly. The moment, you know, that there's an issue act immediately, you got 24 to 48 hours. Before stuff gets moldy and according to the industry, standard 72 hours after something gets wet and stays wet, it's considered moldy. It should be treated as such. So and then of course, if you see something, smell something or feel something.

[00:36:03] Bryan Carroll: Awesome, Jason. Well, thank you so much for coming onto the show. Again, people can find more about you at dot com slash summit for wellness. You're also on Facebook, LinkedIn, and Instagram. And thank you so much. I know mold is a much bigger issue than I think a lot of people are making it out to be. And I think a lot more places are discovering that they have underlying mold issues.

[00:36:25] Which does get very expensive for all the homes out there, but if you can catch it early, it makes it a lot cheaper to fix. And then you know, you won't have all those health issues later on down the road, too. So exactly catch it early. That's right. Like I said before, at the beginning of this episode, I wish I had easy testing kits like this when I was exposed to mold, because it would have made figuring out what was going on with me so much easier, because I could just set one of these up and discover that, Hey, yes, there is mold.

[00:36:55] And that could be a major contributor to why I was stuck in bed and didn't have energy to do anything. So if you want to get your own testing kit, then head on over to dot com. Make sure to use the code summit 10, to get your 10% off why pay full price when you get discounts? Also make sure if you are looking for an electrolyte to add into your daily routine, then check out element, which [email protected] slash L M N T.

[00:37:22] I love the ratio of the different electrolytes in that mix and it tastes really good. And my favorite flavor is raspberry. So head on over there and check it out. Also since spring is here that means the honeybee season will start to be. And as you probably know, I have my own honeybees and we harvest a lot of honey.

[00:37:42] So, and our honey sells out very quickly. So I am going to set up a waitlist here pretty soon. I'll let you know, in the next couple episodes, how you can sign up for that. And then right, when it becomes available, if you are high up on the wait list, then you'll have first access to the. Typically our first harvest will be in July, which is, you know, just a couple months away.

[00:38:04] So it will be here pretty quick. And then you can get your own raw honey that is fresh and local or local to me, I guess. So just stay tuned for when that waitlist will come up until next time, keep climbing to the peak of your health.